By: Libby Fenstermacher
“…grades aren't everything. Being quick isn't everything. You don't need to be a young genius. I feel like most people that are in this field are just normal people. They have a lot of interests; they have a lot of passion and that's what got them the furthest. You don't need to be the smartest person in the office ‘cause everyone relies on everyone.” – Ellesse Lynum-Lozano
Transcript: Libby Fenstermacher and Ellesse Lynum-Lozano
Libby: Hi, everybody. Thanks for joining me today. My name is Libby Fenstermacher, and I'm here today with Ellesse, and she's here to talk with us about being a woman and a student in astronomy. So, thank you so much for being here today. Do you want to share a little bit about yourself and your background with us?
Ellesse: Yes. So just quickly, my name is Ellesse Lynum-Lozano. I'm an incoming senior at Embry-Riddle Aeronautical University. I'm majoring in astronomy and astrophysics. But my school isn't just about me. I'm from Orlando, FL. I was born and raised here, but I've been in a military family, so I moved around a lot. I've been from the East Coast to the Midwest, like all around the US. And just more about me is I'm an Afro-Latina. That's how I identify. I'm half African-American and half Colombian cause that's where my mom was from. So, that’s just a little bit about me.
Libby: Awesome. What inspired you to choose a path in astronomy slash astrophysics in the first place?
Ellesse: Yeah, I guess at first, it’s because I used to live in Florida. We have the John F Kennedy Space Center there, so it was always easy. I used to visit there when I was younger, and I remember I had this one trip. They had an astronomy exhibit and ever since then, I have been interested in learning more. And like my parents, they were very much like, you got to watch documentaries, you got to learn more. So, I would sit down, and I'd watch every astronomy space documentary there ever was. And then growing up, it'd just keep on growing. I had moments where I would leave and come back like, oh, astronomy is probably what I want to do. And by the time I got to middle school and high school, I started taking math courses and physics courses. And I was like, OK, this is probably what I want to do in the future. Astronomy is the way to go.
Libby: It hooked you. Got you in there. That's awesome. What about astronomy excites you?
Ellesse: I feel like astronomy, it's so big. It's a ginormous field. Like you can discover so many things. It's evolving. There are so many theories, so many sections of astronomy that you can always go into. It's not linear. It's not once you're in, you have to focus on one research project for the rest of your life. You can just move around, and skills apply to other things. I also think it's just cool. You get to learn about our universe, our world, the planets, how things began, and the building blocks of everything. There's so much to learn in so little time, so I'll never be bored. And yeah, it just allows me to be a part of something that's sort of bigger than myself. Because not everyone is going to discover something or be the person who discovers a black hole or be the person that discovers a new theory. It's just cool to be able to be involved in a generation that can be like, I helped lead to this. Maybe I didn't find it, but I helped do it.
Libby: Yeah, I feel the same way. That's why I'm here today with you. I just want to be part of all this future discovery. It's so exciting for our understanding of who we are and our place in the universe. I'm excited to see what you end up doing. What about astronomy do you find challenging and what have you done to overcome those challenges?
Ellesse: I think I already said math and physics. Astronomy requires so much background information, which is something I've learned. I guess more recently when I entered college, there's so much you need to learn to even prepare yourself to learn the bigger concepts. It's not all about cool stars and cool galaxies. You have to get into the math, get into the physics. And that was a huge sharing point. When I came to school, I was like, OK, I actually need to focus on learning these things. It might not always be interesting and exciting, but I feel like you sort of need to get through the more boring stuff, the more mundane stuff to get to the more exciting things. And I guess another challenge for me is I'm always the type of person where I like to focus on one thing, like this is what I want to do in the future. This is my goal. But I need to not limit myself. Cause with astronomy, just because you want to enter one field doesn't mean that's the field you're going to enter. Cause I could wake up one day and be like, I don't want to do this anymore. Like maybe I don't want to focus on stars. Maybe I want to move on to galaxies. Maybe I want to discover a different field. I just, you just, can't limit yourself. And that's a big, a big challenge for me. I don't need to focus on one thing. I can range out. Yeah, and it's just such a vast discipline. It's endless in what you can study, and that's what's exciting about it.
Libby: I’m excited for you. What do you think is a common misperception that people have about astronomy as a discipline and as an educational path?
Ellesse: Yeah, I know a huge misconception is it's all about sitting in an observatory, or at least what I thought when I was younger, sitting in an observatory. I'm out all night looking at stars and taking pictures and then going home the next day and starting over. That's barely what anyone does anymore. Like we don't go to observatories. That's usually a thing for the technicians. Everything's remoted in, everything's on your computers. And another one is coding. I had no idea astronomers did coding until I got to college. And I was like, oh, there's a whole new skill I have to learn now. And that was also a huge challenge for me because I feel like also because it's such a small field, not a lot of people are going around saying like, oh, you should go into computer science maybe to help you prepare beforehand. So that's a big part. And I know another misconception, especially with the educational path, is you have to go get your bachelor's in astronomy or you have to get a bachelor's in physics. I've met so many people who've gone in math. Or just computer science and they still go into astronomy. It's not one of those fields where you need to go for a specific degree. You could start anywhere. You could go to work and then join to be an astronomer. You don't need that PhD saying you're an astronomer to technically be one. So, there's a lot of different options.
Libby: That's some really, really solid advice. I'm going to quote you on that in in your in your little article. What are you currently working on right now? What projects?
Ellesse: Yeah, I'm currently at my internship here at NASA Goddard. I'm in Maryland at the moment. That's why I'm in a little different environment than I'm used to. And I'm just working on my project is mostly for like correcting detector effects that could affect like cosmology and results for like the expansion, constant, all these other interesting astronomy things for cosmology for the Roman Space Telescope and I know it's been a really a fun project so far, so I've been really excited about it. And then I know another project I'm sort of working on off and on because I'm here at the internship is I do research with one of my professors. So, it's mostly on binary star systems and we're just checking if it's a binary star. That's always fun to do. And I know outside of schooling and my projects, I know a big goal for me is I do want to do more outreach. I feel like it's really important for astronomers especially to do outreach because our field is so, everyone's in technical language, everyone's saying like scientific words. And so, the normal population who isn't like so focused on what we're doing won't understand why it's important. And so, I think it's really important that everyone can understand things and know how to maybe join the field.
Libby: Absolutely. Understanding our place in space is so important in terms of just understanding humanity as a whole. I mean, it's just anybody can be an astronomer, anybody can be inspired by space and just got to get out there and do it. What are your near future plans?
Ellesse: Oh, well, my near future plans are sort of just going. I'm very much “go with the flow”. So, I guess my biggest future plan is getting into grad school because I am becoming a senior, but I'm also sort of sporadic. Grad school is really important to me, but it's also maybe I want to take a break. So, I've been considering ‘postbac’ programs or just internships cause I know my philosophy is I don't need to go too fast. I think it's important that I'm learning, I'm having fun and I'm still interested in the field. I don't want to go so fast that I burn out by the end of the day. So, I just want to take things a little slower.
Libby: I am an adult learner myself and I personally found a lot of benefit from taking a little break. It ended up prolonging my journey and keeping me on the path in the long run. So, whatever you decide to do, it'll work out. What advice would you give to someone considering a trajectory similar to yours?
Ellesse: I would say going back on that, it's not a race against time. I know how I started with my trajectory is… I actually started college in high school 'cause in Washington where I was living at the time, they had this program called ‘Running Start’ and you could get your associate's by the time you graduated with your diploma, which is really fun and cool. But I now sometimes think maybe I should have just continued in high school because you sort of lose the aspect of just being a kid in college or being a high school student. It's not…you shouldn't be so hell-bent on education. And so, I think people, you just need to take it slow. It's not important that you need to be the one with the most research. You need to have the best grades. It's more important that you are able to still learn while having fun and being interested in it. And I think when other people look out and in and see that you're still really interested, you have so much passion for the field. It's not as important if you have straight As or if you have done like 10 research projects.
Libby: Absolutely. Did you receive any mentorship along your path? And if so, what is some of that advice that was given to you?
Ellesse: I receive a lot of mentorship from my professors cause I'm one of those students. I love talking to my professors and the advice that a close professor has given to me is to always talk to people. When I first entered my first year of college, I didn't do anything. I wasn't… I was focused on getting good grades. I would go to a club meeting once a month. I wasn't really talking to my professors. But it's so important that you make connections early on. And it's not just (that) I need to make connections to get a job with them. You want to make connections to (...) have people you can rely on, have people that can at the end of the day say like this person is really good at this. Or just having someone to give you advice. Cause if I never talked to my professors this year, I would have never found so many people I could rely on. Cause I go to them for everything. I go to them for life problems, not just academics. And cause there they're just senior. They have lived a longer life than me. So, I can always just rely on them for those things.
Libby: That's so important to have that community and that network. And have those people that are willing to support you. I'm glad that you found that at Embry-Riddle. That's wonderful.
Libby: What, if any, changes would you like to see for women in astronomy?
Ellesse: I think there's always a ton of changes. I know for me there's always this competitiveness that I need to be better than you. I need to do more than you. And I know a big problem with women in astronomy specifically, is sometimes women get barred out of these conversations or they're not involved in this research or they're not able to do as much. And I think there doesn't need to be any competitiveness like that. Like it's good to have a little bit cause we can, you know, more competitiveness, we can get more done. But, when there's so much, it just doesn't become a welcoming environment anymore. And that's another big problem, is that there are certain fields in astronomy. I know, and I've been warned that it's going to be hard to be able women to enter this field. Others have had more progression than others. But I know for like more theoretical or even like cosmology, some certain fields, it can be sort of wishy-washy, like maybe be careful, maybe be more cautious. And with that, I know I would love to see more support groups. Recently I've been seeing a lot more women in astronomy groups or helping mentorships for them. And I think it's cool if these certain environments can happen everywhere, like even in universities, there should be a women in astronomy type of program. So, we can encourage more development and see more changes.
Libby: Well, I would encourage you and anybody else watching this to check out the Committee for the Status of Women in Astronomy's page on the American Astronomical Society's website. And there's a ton of resources on there about mentorship and about all sorts of problems that women face in astronomy. So, I'd encourage you to check that out. It's a great resource. So, we're down to our last two questions here. Thanks again for being here today. This has been so informative and so inspiring.
Libby: And now we're going to go off the astronomy track and you're going to tell me what your favorite movie or TV show is.
Ellesse: I’m like a huge nerd, so of course my favorite movie is Interstellar. I wouldn't be an astronomy student without it being my favorite, but it isn't my only one. I know I love horror movies outside of astronomy. I have a huge passion. I collect horror movies VHS tapes, anything John Carpenter… give it to me. Or I know one of my favorite scary movies is The Shining or American Psycho. Those two are really good. And as for TV shows, I'm a huge I watch everything in my off time when I'm not in school. I love watching, whether it be reality TV or documentaries. I know like a really big TV show that everyone's going about is Game of Thrones. I’ve just started entering the Game of Thrones era. I've just started watching it. So, it's been really good so far.
Libby: Yes. Welcome. Welcome to Westeros. Are you? Are you into the Trek?
Ellesse: I am. I am, I am extremely into the Trek.
Libby: Me too. Me too. It's my home. If only if only we lived with the...I mean, I feel like NASA is our own version of Starfleet, frankly.
Ellesse: But it basically is. I think we're basically one of the fleets.
Libby: Yep, absolutely. Well, is there anything else you'd like to share with me today?
Ellesse: No. I guess just like overall for advice I've learned that I think is super important, that everyone needs to know is grades aren't everything. Being quick isn't everything. You don't need to be a young genius. I feel like most people that are in this field are just normal people. They have a lot of interests; they have a lot of passion and that's what got them the furthest. You don't need to be the smartest person in the office ‘cause everyone relies on everyone. Everyone gets advice from other people.
Libby: That's wonderful advice and I am so excited to see what you end up doing on your path. I'm going to be keeping tabs and looking for you in journals. But thanks again for being here this has been wonderful, and I can't wait to share your story. Have a great rest of your day.
Ellesse: Thank you. You, too! Thank you so much for having me.
Libby: Yeah, absolutely! Bye.
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