tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6374266320411149509.post602258794550293065..comments2024-03-25T10:22:36.277-04:00Comments on Women In Astronomy: Which Grad Program Will Be The First To Drop the GRE?Amanpreet Kaurhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/08734178178113146899noreply@blogger.comBlogger13125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6374266320411149509.post-7740328358520037802015-06-20T03:23:46.007-04:002015-06-20T03:23:46.007-04:00Einstein failed his university entrance exam, Darw...Einstein failed his university entrance exam, Darwin didn't make it into medicine, the psychologist Robert Sternberg received a C in introductory Psychology, Thomas Edison was fired from his first two jobs and labelled "too stupid to learn anything", the Wright brothers didn't even go to graduate school, yet they invented a functioning airplane. The list goes on... ... Who knows how many ideas or inventions have been lost to mankind because of poorly validated tests like the GRE, which may prove book learning, getting lucky on the day, or an excellent short-term memory and little else. I think by association, meaning I see solutions to problems/issues in my mind as the result of a conglomeration of data that appears in front of me. Often, I can't understand why others don't see it and I end up questioning myself. It has taken a long time to trust my instincts because of this. No written paper could measure this and certainly not a multiple choice exam.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6374266320411149509.post-54947136381712000392015-04-23T22:16:49.222-04:002015-04-23T22:16:49.222-04:00Also, You would think that Getting a MS in Physics...Also, You would think that Getting a MS in Physics with graduate coursework in the B-A range while completing a research thesis would be enough to show that I can clearly succeed in grad school (on top of the 4 years of research experience elsewhere)Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6374266320411149509.post-10573233837002923402015-04-23T22:14:10.482-04:002015-04-23T22:14:10.482-04:00I am sad that this PGRE is still a thing. I just g...I am sad that this PGRE is still a thing. I just got rejected by 10 graduate programs in physics this year because my PGRE was mediocre. Compared to everything else where I had 4 years of research experience and good GPA. Finding time to study for it was almost impossible while taking the courses needed to graduate with my MS in Physics, which I did well in B-A. It was difficult finding the time to study while researching for my thesis and taking Jackson level courses. Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6374266320411149509.post-41594871798531279482015-01-20T13:14:36.014-05:002015-01-20T13:14:36.014-05:00Try being an engineering major, Jessica! I landed ...Try being an engineering major, Jessica! I landed in a part of the bell curve I had never seen before. Fortunately, I got into a program that took into account my GPA and general GRE scores. I don't know if I would be so lucky these days.CyndiFhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05405982629283290587noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6374266320411149509.post-60852367751090428002015-01-06T12:18:36.999-05:002015-01-06T12:18:36.999-05:00John Johnson: I'm interested by your statement...John Johnson: I'm interested by your statement that " the GRE is always biased, and always selects against white women and people of color". How would one prove that? I think research clearly shows an average bias, but I'm not sure it would even be possible to show that the GRE is biased in every single case. I think the same is true of letters of recommendation - they show a statistically significant level of bias on average over a large population.Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17367937708444729356noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6374266320411149509.post-41338519838886964812015-01-02T13:55:03.944-05:002015-01-02T13:55:03.944-05:00Nick Nelson: A better question is, which metric is...Nick Nelson: A better question is, which metric is more disposable, the GRE or letters of rec? While letters of recommendation can sometimes be biased, not all of them are. However, the GRE is always biased, and always selects against white women and people of color. It seems obvious to me that we should ditch the GRE first, then move toward addressing unconscious bias in letters of recommendation. John Johnsonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13639090412826787107noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6374266320411149509.post-75605000898693202512014-12-28T19:05:15.063-05:002014-12-28T19:05:15.063-05:00My undergrad was at Occidental College, a liberal ...My undergrad was at Occidental College, a liberal arts college, where they didn't offer classes in some of the topics that are covered on the Physics GRE, or where you take these classes after you need to take the GRE for graduate school applications (for instance I hadn't taken any QM before taking the Physics GRE). As a result, my physics GRE score was in the 49th percentile, which is well below the 700 cut-off mentioned in this post. I also have a learning disability, and I am sure that influenced my score on this exam.berkeleyjesshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00255252868558666987noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6374266320411149509.post-57240510601065301252014-12-27T16:44:32.947-05:002014-12-27T16:44:32.947-05:00I am a post-graduate currently in the process of a...I am a post-graduate currently in the process of applying for graduate programs <i>for the second time</i>, and this article really hits home for me. Despite my extensive experience in research (including my own first author paper) I have yet to be accepted into any institutions, and this is likely due to my GRE and PGRE scores.. They're quite terrible, but I know that I can achieve success as a grad student, and the most difficult part of applying to grad programs is convincing the admissions committees that very fact. I am <b>not</b> defined by my GRE scores. Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6374266320411149509.post-714787044388118602014-12-24T10:04:06.897-05:002014-12-24T10:04:06.897-05:00Interesting that the next post on this blog discus...Interesting that the next post on this blog discusses the biases injected into an evaluation process due to letters of recommendation. Which metric is more flawed, GRE scores or letters of recommendation?Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17367937708444729356noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6374266320411149509.post-85862819726183361732014-12-23T18:56:12.022-05:002014-12-23T18:56:12.022-05:00Coming from outside the U.S. system I don't ha...Coming from outside the U.S. system I don't have first hand experience with the GRE, but as an exercise to judge its impact couldn't you undertake the evaluation process without that information, rank your entrants and only then look at the scores? The applicants who rank highly but with lower GREs could then be give special consideration.Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03467934747190433610noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6374266320411149509.post-44035263508209283412014-12-23T17:30:30.417-05:002014-12-23T17:30:30.417-05:00On the issue of expense, I am all in favor of redu...On the issue of expense, I am all in favor of reducing the cost of applying to grad school, but that discussion needs to also include issues like official transcripts (about $20 each) and application fees ($20-$100 each).Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17367937708444729356noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6374266320411149509.post-23346234346051319952014-12-23T17:10:58.553-05:002014-12-23T17:10:58.553-05:00I am all in favor of a more scientific process in ...I am all in favor of a more scientific process in graduate admissions and I agree that there are clear flaws in relying on GRE scores, but I wonder if the other two major components of the graduate admissions process (undergraduate transcripts and letters of recommendation) are any less flawed or do any better of a job predicting success in grad school? My hunch, and it is only a hunch, is that were GPAs and letters of recommendation as easy to quantify and compare we would find just as much bias in them, along with just as poor predictive capability, as we do in GRE scores.Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17367937708444729356noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6374266320411149509.post-36594689385881896612014-12-23T01:41:01.053-05:002014-12-23T01:41:01.053-05:00I am in favor of getting rid of the GRE altogether...I am in favor of getting rid of the GRE altogether. But if you are not going to do that right now, at the very least you can save applicants a lot of money by not requiring official score reports until after a student is committed to enrolling --- instead requiring applicants to simply self-report their scores. Most places already do this with official transcripts, allowing applicants to submit unofficial transcripts (or scans of official transcripts) at the time of the application and then, requiring mailed official transcripts only upon enrollment.<br />Nobody is going to lie about their GRE scores if it would put them at risk of having their admission revoked.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.com